Budget HD-DVD player sells 90k over week-end

[Zeus]

According to sources close to retailers, the budget Toshiba HD-A2 HD DVD player sold around 90,000 units on the week-end alone which will be sure to boost the installed base of HD DVD players. The player was cut to $99 across a number of retailers a short while ago.


The HD DVD format significantly pumped its installed base over the weekend, as dueling store clearances sold an estimated 90,000 Toshiba players, according to sources close to retailers.

That tally covers Friday to Sunday sales of Toshiba’s second-generation HD-A2 model, which Wal-Mart and Best Buy sold for about $99 on Nov. 2. That’s $200 less than Toshiba’s $299 list price and $100 off widespread retail pricing of $199.

The $99 players made up most of the 90,000 units sold, a source said.


News Source: <A href="http://www.videobusiness.com/article/CA6498141.html" target="_blank">Videobusiness</a>

[JordanBlack68]

1080i no thank you

[XxBigP123xX]

they're going to be losing so much on these things:D

hd dvdead sucks.

[put4558350]

$100 for upscale dvd + hd-dvd player is kind of cool.
Well I will wait for CH-DVD for $50 that will come soon.

[11111]

According to sources close to retailers, the budget Toshiba HD-A2 HD DVD player sold around 90,000 units on the week-end alone which will be sure to boost the installed base of HD DVD players. The player was cut to $99 across a number of retailers a short while ago.



News Source: <A href="http://www.videobusiness.com/article/CA6498141.html" target="_blank">Videobusiness</a>

it only sold alot cuz everyone's ebaying em. just look at it. what's funny is they're only averaging around 130 totally not worth the wait to resell.

[(V)ega]

I don't see the big issue with some of you. 1080i and 1080p. Can you really noticed that big of a difference??? I have a 1080i Sony TV and a friend of mine has a newer 1080p Sony TV and all of the HD looks amazing to my eye and i'm sitting directly infront of the TV almost...lol Can someone tell me what's so drastically better about the p?

MeGa

[iLLNESS]

I don't see the big issue with some of you. 1080i and 1080p. Can you really noticed that big of a difference??? I have a 1080i Sony TV and a friend of mine has a newer 1080p Sony TV and all of the HD looks amazing to my eye and i'm sitting directly infront of the TV almost...lol Can someone tell me what's so drastically better about the p?

MeGa

its not a huge difference
only difference is, 1080p is out so most people think 1080i is ****.
even though, for $100 id take 1080i over nothing unlike allthe whiners in here complaining about how its only 1080i. ahahah

[blade47167]

Wow so much for banking on increased player sales lmao.

90k Units @ $400 loss each.

Lawl 36mil down the drain for nothing.

[canadajames]

They would give these things away for free if Microsoft would dish out the bucks and they were certain they'd win the format war cause if they did win theyd have a monopoly aside from hackers with hd dvd and bluray burners. wether or not blu ray win it still has ps3 using it which will secure it as being used for this gen and perhaps next gen too for sony hd dvd is desperate and are showing it by this move.

[inde]

my god why does every thread that mentions hd dvd have to be filled with morons debating the 2 formats.
look at the price, for so cheap do you really give a toss or not if its 1080i?
i know i wouldnt.

i have both formats, blu ray and hd dvd, neither are better than each other, both have plus and minus points.
classic case of blu ray gets this film, hd dvd gets that film.
either way im set, i think its better to be able to freely buy for both instead of bashing the other because i only own the 1 format.

[Happsai]

Wow so much for banking on increased player sales lmao.

90k Units @ $400 loss each.

Lawl 36mil down the drain for nothing.
The Toshiba model is selling at a loss of $400 per unit? Wow! That's interesting! I'd sure like to know the source of your brilliant research!

[Hmerly]

Toshiba is not losing money on this sale. It was firstly initiated by Wal-Mart themselves. Secondly, the cost to manufacture the A2 is significantly less than that of the A1 which people are using to base costs on the A2. You can't try to estimate the cost of a product that is 1 year older and uses totally different parts. It is moronic and if you believe it you're moronic. This sale was in fact a genius move and a boon for HD DVD and its partners. In 3 days, there have been as many HD DVD players sold as there has been sold since the inception of the best selling stand alone Blu-Ray player.

1080i from a 1080p source sent to a 1080p display is not discernable from a 1080p source sent 1080p to a 1080p display. Sorry, move along. Look it up if you're skeptical.

[whackawookie]

The Toshiba model is selling at a loss of $400 per unit? Wow! That's interesting! I'd sure like to know the source of your brilliant research!

whats funny is the ps3 is selling for a loss of roughly oh - 400 dollars. but i guess when the tables are turned its a different story for instance this comment

it only sold alot cuz everyone's ebaying em. just look at it. what's funny is they're only averaging around 130 totally not worth the wait to resell.
why by that logic the ps3 should have had a 0 share at launch in the us afterall almost everybody that got a launch console sold it on ebay. fanboyism is retarded especially when you speak fiction and claim its fact

[billysastard]

its not a huge difference
only difference is, 1080p is out so most people think 1080i is ****.
even though, for $100 id take 1080i over nothing unlike allthe whiners in here complaining about how its only 1080i. ahahah

i think you'll find that all those whiners complaining about it being 1080i are all sony blu-raystation3 fanboys, i mean some are so stupid that not only cant they read but basic maths is way beyond them too, like the example below


Toshiba’s $299 list price


then


90k Units @ $400 loss each.

Lawl 36mil down the drain for nothing.



:mad:

[billysastard]

my god why does every thread that mentions hd dvd have to be filled with morons debating the 2 formats.
look at the price, for so cheap do you really give a toss or not if its 1080i?
i know i wouldnt.

i have both formats, blu ray and hd dvd, neither are better than each other, both have plus and minus points.
classic case of blu ray gets this film, hd dvd gets that film.
either way im set, i think its better to be able to freely buy for both instead of bashing the other because i only own the 1 format.

i have both formats too but i'd never consider buying a drm-ray disc ever, simply because i can get pretty much any drm-ray film on hd-dvd from somewhere in the world and hd-dvd is region free, the only reason i ended up with a drm-ray player at all is because i was forced to get one in order to play blu-raystation 3 games.

[Xenontc]

they're going to be losing so much on these things:D

hd dvdead sucks.

You make it sound like BD is going to be a successful replacement format for the DVD. Which we all know it won't be. So BD fails just as hard as HD-DVD, just the people failing with the HD-DVD still have $300 in his/her pocket.

[blade47167]

whats funny is the ps3 is selling for a loss of roughly oh - 400 dollars. but i guess when the tables are turned its a different story for instance this comment

Lawl the source whore posts info without a source. The PS3 was only losing ~$150 on the 60GB premium model at base production. Losing $400 a machine now? Your off your damn rocker. Everyone knows which way you float and I'm not gonna get into another source war with you because no matter how many sources I provide you plead ignorance and continue to believe you are the holy source of all that is truth. So whatever to you... :rolleyes:

The Toshiba model is selling at a loss of $400 per unit? Wow! That's interesting! I'd sure like to know the source of your brilliant research!

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/format-war/every-99-hd-dvd-player-losing-500-319172.php

:eek:

i think you'll find that all those whiners complaining about it being 1080i are all sony blu-raystation3 fanboys, i mean some are so stupid that not only cant they read but basic maths is way beyond them too, like the example below

Didn't quote your some random blu-ray fanboy but suck my d*ck yes? I clearly have a source.

And your talking about stupidity when you can't even capitalize your "I". You learn that **** before you even enter the school system.

And wookie delete my post I know you will :D

[KPunk]

1080i no thank you

ummmm, if you have a 1080p tv that doesn't matter as it will play the video in 1080p still, do the research.

[11111]

whats funny is the ps3 is selling for a loss of roughly oh - 400 dollars. but i guess when the tables are turned its a different story for instance this comment

why by that logic the ps3 should have had a 0 share at launch in the us afterall almost everybody that got a launch console sold it on ebay. fanboyism is retarded especially when you speak fiction and claim its fact

ummm i dont really know what to say i'm actually neutral and i'm not here to try to start anything. i'm just saying that's what they're selling on ebay right now with the same model.

i'm not trying to add more fuel into anything but wasnt there stats early on that a whole crap load of people sold the ps3 at launch on ebay (including a ton of my friends).

i think i'm going to stay away from any threads for a while with anything remotely bluray or hd-dvd in the title. everyone's gettin pretty hot hot hot.

[daps83777]

1080i no thank you

if you knew anything about movies and the difference they have between 1080i and 1080p you wouldn't make a stupid comment like that.

[pezjono]

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/format-war/every-99-hd-dvd-player-losing-500-319172.php

:eek:





Again, that is for the A1.
Yes, it's been a year since then that the A2 release and nobody has an exact price difference. Judging a price loss compared to old technology is stupid. He says roughly 30% in the article with absolutely no source or references. It's all a guess, yet you posted it as fact in your previous post.

For $100, what the F*CK do you want?

[Lego]

Lawl the source whore posts info without a source. The PS3 was only losing ~$150 on the 60GB premium model at base production. Losing $400 a machine now? Your off your damn rocker. Everyone knows which way you float and I'm not gonna get into another source war with you because no matter how many sources I provide you plead ignorance and continue to believe you are the holy source of all that is truth. So whatever to you... :rolleyes:



http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/format-war/every-99-hd-dvd-player-losing-500-319172.php

:eek:



Didn't quote your some random blu-ray fanboy but suck my d*ck yes? I clearly have a source.

And your talking about stupidity when you can't even capitalize your "I". You learn that **** before you even enter the school system.

And wookie delete my post I know you will :D


Since you're so terribly proud of your education, perhaps you should bother to learn the difference between a "." (period) and a "?" (question mark). Glass houses and all that. Your source isn't really worth very much since it is pure conjecture, admits itself to be such and doesn't cite any current hard data.

[pCeSlAyEr]

if you knew anything about movies and the difference they have between 1080i and 1080p you wouldn't make a stupid comment like that.

exactly...


as for the 90k... :( it was sold out by 8am :( :(... and yes they started selling them at 8am:(

[So-Unreal]

1080i no thank youif your TV is doing what it should be then 1080p vs 1080i is not that big of a deal.

[dennis872007]

this wont do much good to hd-dvd since its clearance and they will run out. now if they lowered the hd-dvd add on for the 360 than sony would have to be worried.

[crypticshift]

Not sure why I am weighing in on this and I doubt it will get much traction as this is my first post on these forums, but...
Anyone else remember Betamax? Sony developed a superior product in almost every way, but VHS won anyhow. This could be attributed to any number of things like the fact that adult video companies had a much easier time getting the license to use VHS or that it may have been cheaper to own and operate. Funny how the porn has had such a key role in technology, but thats another whole post...

I can't help but see a parallel here. Sony loves to create new ways of using technology which break from the norm (which I applaud)...however, most of the time, the less impressive and cheaper product wins out. Blu-ray versus HD-DVD is just the latest 'battle of the technologies'. Smart money says wait and see...unless you are an early adopter, or rich enough to own both! :rolleyes:

[0 morgan 0]

It's funny all the 1080i whiners are PS3 owners... I doubt no more than 30% of the whiners even have a 1080p TV... lol

[Oxmyx]

Hmm...

You think maybe these consumer electronics companies might be getting the hint that PRICE DOES MATTER?

PS3's down to 399 and starting to pick up sales. Well maybe Sony still does not get it saying in it's usual arrogant way that they will not lower their blu-ray player to less than $399 for the fall buying season. Tactical error Sony! If Sony wants to establish blu-ray as dominant, then they will have to buy it like Microsoft and Toshiba are seemingly doing.

Can anyone imagine the future royalties at stake for the format that takes dominance in the HD disc formats? This mess has already cost untold lost revenues by putting off consumers while they wait and see which one to buy.

The fact is, even the merchants are wary as evidenced by there being very little discs stocked in the stores. Yeah, you can buy a player, but then try and find some HD discs to buy and play in them.

I just can't see how the executives that are making the decisions for these companies are keeping their jobs, let alone earning those six figure salaries and stock options.

[Turbojugend]

A few things about the stupid format war

1) Nobody is really buying either right now to make a difference, at least in North America, 10-15% of the population has HD Tvs.

2) Very few people are using their Ps3 as a blu-ray movie player, very few.

3) Seeing Sonys new marketing campaign I had to laugh, "only available on HD blu-ray"

deailing with joe shmo customer for a long time now, alls people will get from that is HD, which translates to HD-DVD.

I could care less, I have the LG combo drive for my media center, plays and burns both HD-DVD and bluray, and I got it for 280 bux.

[Oxmyx]

Not sure why I am weighing in on this and I doubt it will get much traction as this is my first post on these forums, but...
Anyone else remember Betamax? Sony developed a superior product in almost every way, but VHS won anyhow. This could be attributed to any number of things like the fact that adult video companies had a much easier time getting the license to use VHS or that it may have been cheaper to own and operate. Funny how the porn has had such a key role in technology, but thats another whole post...:

Porn? Well as I remember it, when both formats started to compete for the consumer video tape market, VHS at SP could hold 2 hours of video and Beta I could hold 90 minutes. Well aren't most moves longer than 90 minutes? Then there was the first generation $900 JVC VHS machine versus the $1800 Sony Beta machine, which, at the time, were both far from my $180 a week paycheck's reach.

[grapeape]

Lawl the source whore posts info without a source. The PS3 was only losing ~$150 on the 60GB premium model at base production. Losing $400 a machine now? Your off your damn rocker. Everyone knows which way you float and I'm not gonna get into another source war with you because no matter how many sources I provide you plead ignorance and continue to believe you are the holy source of all that is truth. So whatever to you... :rolleyes:

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/format-war/every-99-hd-dvd-player-losing-500-319172.php


According to your source the 60gb PS3 had a loss of $241.35 when it was selling at $599.

http://www.isuppli.com/news/default.asp?id=6919

Incidently and unrelated to the topic according to them the 360 premium was actually making a $75.70 profit.

[Xenontc]

1) Nobody is really buying either right now to make a difference, at least in North America, 10-15% of the population has HD Tvs.

I honestly think that number is a little high, 10% sounds like a possible number, but 2% is probably a real number for "True HD", aka 1080P.

2) Very few people are using their Ps3 as a blu-ray movie player, very few.

*Waits for someone to come in and say "BUT TEH PS3 CUMZ WIT TEH FR33 MOOVIZ!"

3) Seeing Sonys new marketing campaign I had to laugh, "only available on HD blu-ray"

I honestly thought of the same thing, it's like they're saying to the people "Hey you guys are dumb because you don't know Blu-Ray is HIGH DEFINITION, so we're going to call it HIGH DEFINITION Blu-Ray."

[grd94533]

Back to the "TOPIC" this unit is one hell of a deal. I might have gotten it myself if it wasn't for all the cool games coming out in the next few days (BOTH 360 AND PS3) so I couldn't afford it. I don't know about the comment that one guy made about it being able to play in 1080P if your TV has 1080P though. I think 1080i is the max for this unit. Even though it's still one hell of a deal. As far as comparison goes with 1080i and 1080p, there is a major difference in them but it's really only noticeable if you have a large high quality HDTV or monitor.

[dennis872007]

A few things about the stupid format war

1) Nobody is really buying either right now to make a difference, at least in North America, 10-15% of the population has HD Tvs.

2) Very few people are using their Ps3 as a blu-ray movie player, very few.

3) Seeing Sonys new marketing campaign I had to laugh, "only available on HD blu-ray"

deailing with joe shmo customer for a long time now, alls people will get from that is HD, which translates to HD-DVD.

I could care less, I have the LG combo drive for my media center, plays and burns both HD-DVD and bluray, and I got it for 280 bux.

number two is false. hd-dvd has beaten in sales the stand alone blu ray players yet when transformers came out blu ray sales still beat it. an hd tvs are one of the most wanted items this holiday season

[LegolasFett]

The comparison of 1080i and 1080p is so minimal it's near impossible to tell. It has more to do with the quality of the TV than it being interlaced or progressive. Besides like someone else posted if you have a 1080p TV it will play the movie in 1080p thus making the i/p 100% moot.

I just recently got my first HDTV, while I know it isn't the best quality it does what I need it to do. To save money on new formats as well as rebuying all my old DVDs again I opted for a upconvert for $60 at Sams, which was about a month ago. I then saw this sale and thought it does upconvert so that's $60 I already spent.

I went out at 6PM on Friday and they actually had some left by me. Besides for $106 (tax) you get 7 total things if you break it down.
Upconvert ($60)+HDDVD+5 movies. Since I already spent $60 that brings the total cost of the 6 things to $40, so 40/6=6.67. You can't beat that deal.

HD-DVD may lose the "war" or BR may OR imagine this NEITHER will. This is the SAME thing as what video game consoles are dealing with and have for YEARS. Hardware exclusives, how many games are only on PS3, or Wii, or 360? Yes of course some are selling more than others and by the end of this gen 1 will come on top, but that does NOT mean the other 2 have failed.

[MaTiAz]

1080i60 is more than enough to transmit a 1080p24 signal, so if your TV's deinterlacer isn't pure ****, you won't se any difference.

And I doubt people looking for this price point HD DVD player won't care if it does 1080p. They most likely don't have a 1080p TV either.

[aceboomer]

look folks, 1080i is all you need for a few years as all movies are filmed at 24fps that there is no notable difference when its output as 1080i or 1080p. until movies are digitally filmed at 60fps, 1080p won't be a necessity for movies. right now only video games are benefiting from 1080p output as they can runt at 60fps.

[sigma8]

I don't see the big issue with some of you. 1080i and 1080p. Can you really noticed that big of a difference??? I have a 1080i Sony TV and a friend of mine has a newer 1080p Sony TV and all of the HD looks amazing to my eye and i'm sitting directly infront of the TV almost...lol Can someone tell me what's so drastically better about the p?

MeGa

Well, technically, 1080p gives you 1920x1080....pure and simple. 1080i gives you two screens of 1920x540, and very quickly alternates between them to present a full image of 1920x1080. Basically, if you freeze frame it, and there is no special filtering going on, you'd see only every other vertical line on any given freeze-frame. You have only half the data at any one instant.

But, it alternates so fast, that you can't really see it too easily. Standard television broadcast is similarly interlaced--you only get every other vertical line at any one instant. Most TV's have built-in filters to minimize the "serrated edge" effect (entirely different from jaggies--it's much more extreme if unfiltered), but even on a good TV with good filtering, you can sometimes see them. Especially when there's a lot of motion on-screen.

Personally, I'd rather range 720p than 1080i. The p images are just more stable, and there are fewer potential issues. If you DO plan to do freezeframing for any reason, definitely "p" is the way to go.

edit: rather "range"? I meant rather "watch". I'm leaving that typo in because it's so weird.

[daps83777]

http://www.hometheatermag.com/gearworks/1106gear/

[billysastard]

Lawl the source whore posts info without a source. The PS3 was only losing ~$150 on the 60GB premium model at base production. Losing $400 a machine now? Your off your damn rocker. Everyone knows which way you float and I'm not gonna get into another source war with you because no matter how many sources I provide you plead ignorance and continue to believe you are the holy source of all that is truth. So whatever to you... :rolleyes:



http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/format-war/every-99-hd-dvd-player-losing-500-319172.php

:eek:



Didn't quote your some random blu-ray fanboy but suck my d*ck yes? I clearly have a source.

And your talking about stupidity when you can't even capitalize your "I". You learn that **** before you even enter the school system.

And wookie delete my post I know you will :D

great source of info that is, pity its ages out of date and about the wrong machine still i guess the blu-ray mist was obscuring your vision or maybe the "source" wasnt in 1080p so you couldnt see it properly.

just to clarify the first br-player was around $1500+ and its now what? around $400, thats quite a difference but i doubt sony are loosing $1100 on each machine, its more likely that costs have fallen rapidly, guess that could also be why this discontinued model is so much cheaper than the original model quoted in your source.

on a seperate note i can capitalize my "I" and i did learn to do that when it was supposed to be done, in fact, i still do it when i'm writing, however when typing (which i'm crap at anyway) i dont bother and luckily almost everyone accepts that its a forum post and doesnt try to spell or grammer check me or anyone else, in fact the only time i see such posts its usualy coming from someone who whilst normaly making beautifuly crafted posts are nevertheless talking utter bollocks.

:D

[billysastard]

http://www.hometheatermag.com/gearworks/1106gear/

that was realy usefull info, thanks.

[Ragnarok]

its not a huge difference
only difference is, 1080p is out so most people think 1080i is ****.
even though, for $100 id take 1080i over nothing unlike allthe whiners in here complaining about how its only 1080i. ahahah


There might not be a huge difference, but it's an uneasy thought for some people out there if they know they don't have the top of the line quality. And I'm one of those people. Having 1080i won't sit easy with me knowing that I can have 1080p instead. I mean if you're gonna go hi def, why not go all the way right?

[DEDDOA]

Wow so much for banking on increased player sales lmao.

90k Units @ $400 loss each.

Lawl 36mil down the drain for nothing.

So how is this bad for the consumer, bad for toshiba if HD-DVD fails, but how is this in anyway shape or form a negative for the consumer:confused:. Dude I think you are picking at straws here, because all I see in your statement is plus's all round for those getting the player. Maybe you should pull your head out of Sony's ass for a few seconds and take a breath of clean air as what you been breathing is clearly messing with your mind :rolleyes:

Also, where is 90k in one wekend a bad thing, thats not much different to what the PS3 manged in the first few days, I suspect any consumer electronics manufacturere would be very happy to sell that many units that quickly. I suspect the only concern is if it continues to sell well.

[Cheunce]

There might not be a huge difference, but it's an uneasy thought for some people out there if they know they don't have the top of the line quality. And I'm one of those people. Having 1080i won't sit easy with me knowing that I can have 1080p instead. I mean if you're gonna go hi def, why not go all the way right?

You will not see any difference between a 720p or 1080p video unless you have a TV that is bigger than 50" unless you sit relay close to it

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=768167

[busboy33]

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/format-war/every-99-hd-dvd-player-losing-500-319172.php

:eek:



Let's take a few quotes from your "source":

"for reference, the first HD-A1 HD DVD player cost Toshiba $674 in parts alone"

So that was the cost of the last model . . . not this one. The price quote for parts is cited from iSuppli, 2006. So, depending on when in 2006 those numbers came from, it's at least 11 months old, and at most 23 months old. For a different model.

"Within a calendar year, I very much doubt that it could have been price-optimized more than 30% (*number pulled out of thin air)."

That, my ignorant friend, is called in the buisness a guess. You can tell because the writer clearly notes he's just making up that number, and uses tricky language like "I doubt" which indicates an opinion as opposed to "they cannot reduce costs . . . " which would tend to indicate more of whats called a researched fact.

"I have no evidence either way."

That kind of speaks for itself, doesn't it?

So . . . you cite to somebody's guess (which they freely admit is a guess), and quote it as fact. I suppose that makes sense. After all, it was written down on the Interwebs, so it must be true (as long as you ignore the clear and repeated "I'm just guessing here" language).
I will give you points for citing to your source, even though it kind of proves you're a fanatical, post-twisting Sony whore. That takes guts. Not too many active brain cells, but guts.

[segaman1977]

OK, let me give you the results of my personal physical test. I did buy the $99 Toshiba player last Friday at Wally World. I ran this visual test on my 40" sony Bravia w/DNA enhance television. Both the Toshiba and my PS3 are connected via HDMI. I borrowed '300' on HD as I already own the blu-ray version. The tv tags the ps3 as 1080p, and also tags the Toshiba as 1080p, although the Toshiba's lcd panel indicates 1080i. I ran both movies and fast forward to all the first major battle halfway through. I sat relatively close to the tv, about 5 feet away. The tv does have a little lag between input switching so I did a little rewinding and replay just to be fair. The PS3 seemed to define the dark backgrounds a little better than the HD-DVD version but seems to cause a flickering effect. The HD-DVD backgrounds were a little dark, but the brighter colors and the flesh were very sharp and vivid, actually a little purer than the Blu-ray. Both versions did have the exact same blur effect during high movement even though the PS3 was at true 1080p. The sound seemed the same too, although I have a rather generic sound system downstairs. I paused the picture and they look identical, with a slight color discreprancy, nothing too radical on either side. The tv actually drew all 1080 lines even on a still. I am now convinced that the tv has a reigning impact on the result of the final picture. I am officially very happy with the deal I got and fully support HD-DVDs fight to stay in the game. I don't see any benefit of investing into a player for more money that can decode 1080p. I hope this helps answer any Qs.

[solwretep]

The sound seemed the same too, although I have a rather generic sound system downstairs..

You were trying to listen to the sound a floor above your soundsystem? Now thats some review! More please

[whackawookie]

Lawl the source whore posts info without a source. The PS3 was only losing ~$150 on the 60GB premium model at base production. Losing $400 a machine now? Your off your damn rocker. Everyone knows which way you float and I'm not gonna get into another source war with you because no matter how many sources I provide you plead ignorance and continue to believe you are the holy source of all that is truth. So whatever to you... :rolleyes:


source, sure i got a source lets see

In the weeks since the PS3's worldwide launch, it's been opened up and smashed. Now it's being broken down into its component parts by iSuppli, a well-respected group of technology analysts. They've totaled up the cost of the PS3's parts and determined that the cost of each $600 box is $840. That means they're taking a bath on each 60GB console to the tune of $240 (and how's that for a mixed metaphor
less then a year after launch sony dropped the 20gig model and lowered the price of the 60gig by 100 so 240 plus 100 equals 340, why thats awfully close to 400 plus they lowered the price of the 80gig model which comes with
a 60dollar game... you know what, i think ive proven my point

http://blog.wired.com/games/2006/11/isupply_ps3_com.htmlwith

[segaman1977]

You were trying to listen to the sound a floor above your soundsystem? Now thats some review! More please

I know that was sarcasm but my entire gaming setup is downstairs. I have a 52" DLP projection in my actual upstairs living room but didn't feel it was suited for performing such a visual comparison.

[MadonnaProject]

wow thats about 45 pounds. even i would buy that.

[Gav_]

Well, technically, 1080p gives you 1920x1080....pure and simple. 1080i gives you two screens of 1920x540, and very quickly alternates between them to present a full image of 1920x1080. Basically, if you freeze frame it, and there is no special filtering going on, you'd see only every other vertical line on any given freeze-frame. You have only half the data at any one instant.


In the HD spec the 1080i/29.97 signal that this player outputs consists of two 1080x540 frames (taken from the 1080p HD DVD source). Any decent 1080p pannel will take the two frames and rebuild the 1080p/29.97 frame and display it non-interlaced (a 99% true 1080p signal*).

Only word of warning is that you should check your 1080p lcd/plasma/projector accepts a 1080i/29.97 signal. All the very newest models should, but for example even in 2006 there are many 1080p projectors that only take pure 1080p signal (e.g. http://www.hdtvexpert.com/pages_b/blu-ray_players.html).

*The advantages to having a true 1080p source and display is that it won't matter if you have a 1080p/60, 1080p/30, 1080p/29.97 source - it will be displayed as pure as it can be (no frame changing from a 30fps source to 29.97 or vise versa at source or display end). PS3 and Xbox 360 video games that support 1080p @60fps will be best on a 1080p display. Depending on how the 1080p's chispset builds the 1080i two frame image from a source like the A02 will determine the quality - usually a 1080p frame is built and displayed as is. If there are ever any 1080p/60 HD DVD discs (probably never) you would need a 1080p/60 source to see them at full glory. And then last but not least, there is the "1080p" label instead of "1080i" on the front of the player.


read these:
http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-6449_7-6361600-1.html (paragraph Why 1080p is theoretically better than 1080i).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1080i
"1080i is compatible with newer 720p- and 1080p-based televisions but must be *deinterlaced* first in order to be displayed" and "Due to interlacing, 1080i has twice the frame-rate but half the resolution of a 1080p"

[Happsai]

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/format-war/every-99-hd-dvd-player-losing-500-319172.php
:eek:
Didn't quote your some random blu-ray fanboy but suck my d*ck yes? I clearly have a source.

And your talking about stupidity when you can't even capitalize your "I". You learn that **** before you even enter the school system.

And wookie delete my post I know you will :D
Hate to break it to you, but I read your little "source", and they're talking about the A1, not the A2.
Your article even states and I quote:
I have no evidence either way. This is an older model
Lol... don't you even read your own evidence or do you just see what you wish were true?

[Desolationstorm]

OK, let me give you the results of my personal physical test. I did buy the $99 Toshiba player last Friday at Wally World. I ran this visual test on my 40" sony Bravia w/DNA enhance television. Both the Toshiba and my PS3 are connected via HDMI. I borrowed '300' on HD as I already own the blu-ray version. The tv tags the ps3 as 1080p, and also tags the Toshiba as 1080p, although the Toshiba's lcd panel indicates 1080i. I ran both movies and fast forward to all the first major battle halfway through. I sat relatively close to the tv, about 5 feet away. The tv does have a little lag between input switching so I did a little rewinding and replay just to be fair. The PS3 seemed to define the dark backgrounds a little better than the HD-DVD version but seems to cause a flickering effect. The HD-DVD backgrounds were a little dark, but the brighter colors and the flesh were very sharp and vivid, actually a little purer than the Blu-ray. Both versions did have the exact same blur effect during high movement even though the PS3 was at true 1080p. The sound seemed the same too, although I have a rather generic sound system downstairs. I paused the picture and they look identical, with a slight color discreprancy, nothing too radical on either side. The tv actually drew all 1080 lines even on a still. I am now convinced that the tv has a reigning impact on the result of the final picture. I am officially very happy with the deal I got and fully support HD-DVDs fight to stay in the game. I don't see any benefit of investing into a player for more money that can decode 1080p. I hope this helps answer any Qs.

Good review

I picked up the player, who wouldnt for that price?(well thats been answered;)) I was a good deal and seeing as how I have a 40" samsung 720p tv the fact that its not 1080p doesnt really matter. As for which format it doesnt really matter to me, at some point next year Ill pick up a ps3 simply to own all three since i recently got a good job and have money to blow. So I will have both formats though the only movies I really want on Blueray are the pirate movies. until I get the ps3 I have to deal we watching a blueray rip on my 360.:eek: Though I delete them right away since they are so big and not gonna watch them over and over again.

[cokemusic1]

THey couldn't have sold those $99 HD-DVD players at a proift right ? very impressive if toshiba managed that.

Blu-Ray camp should think hard about how they'll respond.

[Desolationstorm]

THey couldn't have sold those $99 HD-DVD players at a proift right ? very impressive if toshiba managed that.

Blu-Ray camp should think hard about how they'll respond.

Wont be sony that will they have already said they will not have one lower then $400. Though the A2s are gone now its the A3s at 200 and 9 free movies that Im sure will attract people. If I had someone with a hd tv I would totally buy them that cant beat nine movies.

I doubt they made a profit, its about keeping the format going. If after this holiday season there are 250,000(Ill include the 90,000 A2s thats only 160,000 more think thats reasonable) more hd dvd owners in the US well things will be a bit better for toshiba and company.

I enjoy people saying HD dvd is dead. According to their logic though if HD dvd is dead because Blueray is outselling the PS3 is dead because wii is outselling. We all know thats silly though because its the start of the generation, neither are dead its early in both their fights.

[arcticjoe]

it wasnt toshiba who dropped the price, it was Walmart and other retailers. Also, I would bet they are still raking in some proffit even at $99. Retailers like kmart get their electronic goods at riddiculously low prices, I wouldnt be surprised if that player costs them a mere $40 when bought in bulk.

[MadMax31]

Yeah HD-DVD is soo dead...:rolleyes:

[dennis872007]

Yeah HD-DVD is soo dead...:rolleyes:

it was. retailers were obviously not selling enough hd-dvd titles so they where force to do this.

[kickinass]

it was. retailers were obviously not selling enough hd-dvd titles so they where force to do this.

I don't know, I think if BD was selling that crazy in comparison, they would just completely drop HD-DVD.

[dennis872007]

I don't know, I think if BD was selling that crazy in comparison, they would just completely drop HD-DVD.

its not selling alot more but it is selling more. and to mark a 300 for 100 dollars just proves how desperate they were.

[(V)ega]

Well, technically, 1080p gives you 1920x1080....pure and simple. 1080i gives you two screens of 1920x540, and very quickly alternates between them to present a full image of 1920x1080. Basically, if you freeze frame it, and there is no special filtering going on, you'd see only every other vertical line on any given freeze-frame. You have only half the data at any one instant.

But, it alternates so fast, that you can't really see it too easily. Standard television broadcast is similarly interlaced--you only get every other vertical line at any one instant. Most TV's have built-in filters to minimize the "serrated edge" effect (entirely different from jaggies--it's much more extreme if unfiltered), but even on a good TV with good filtering, you can sometimes see them. Especially when there's a lot of motion on-screen.

Personally, I'd rather range 720p than 1080i. The p images are just more stable, and there are fewer potential issues. If you DO plan to do freezeframing for any reason, definitely "p" is the way to go.

edit: rather "range"? I meant rather "watch". I'm leaving that typo in because it's so weird.

Thanks Sigma8, that helped clear up a few things for me. :D

[grapeape]

I cant see them taking too much of a hit on these...the A3 is only selling for $70 more at regular price.

[daps83777]

I cant see them taking too much of a hit on these...the A3 is only selling for $70 more at regular price.

exactly if these hd-dvd players where so expensive to manufacture then why are they all getting cheaper? hd-dvd uses similiar technology to standard dvd for alot of the stuff from what i have read so it would make sense that prices should fall fairly rapidly with hd-dvd players because you would expect the technology to be getting cheaper very quickly.

[DugFreez]

OK, let me give you the results of my personal physical test. I did buy the $99 Toshiba player last Friday at Wally World. I ran this visual test on my 40" sony Bravia w/DNA enhance television. Both the Toshiba and my PS3 are connected via HDMI. I borrowed '300' on HD as I already own the blu-ray version. The tv tags the ps3 as 1080p, and also tags the Toshiba as 1080p, although the Toshiba's lcd panel indicates 1080i. I ran both movies and fast forward to all the first major battle halfway through. I sat relatively close to the tv, about 5 feet away. The tv does have a little lag between input switching so I did a little rewinding and replay just to be fair. The PS3 seemed to define the dark backgrounds a little better than the HD-DVD version but seems to cause a flickering effect. The HD-DVD backgrounds were a little dark, but the brighter colors and the flesh were very sharp and vivid, actually a little purer than the Blu-ray. Both versions did have the exact same blur effect during high movement even though the PS3 was at true 1080p. The sound seemed the same too, although I have a rather generic sound system downstairs. I paused the picture and they look identical, with a slight color discreprancy, nothing too radical on either side. The tv actually drew all 1080 lines even on a still. I am now convinced that the tv has a reigning impact on the result of the final picture. I am officially very happy with the deal I got and fully support HD-DVDs fight to stay in the game. I don't see any benefit of investing into a player for more money that can decode 1080p. I hope this helps answer any Qs.


When you were testing 300 you should have tested the Picture in Picture funtion on the Blu-Ray version...or tried the Web Enabled features on the Blu-Ray version. OH! I forgot...BLU-RAY DOESN'T HAVE THOSE FEATURES!!! ;)