Microsoft: We Didn't Pay Paramount for HD DVD

[Zeus]

PRESS RELEASE: Microsoft: We Didn't Pay Paramount for HD DVD

Kevin Collins, who runs Microsoft's HD DVD unit, is denying that his company paid Paramount to exclusively back HD DVD in the high-def format war against Blu-ray.

Paramount and DreamWorks last week stunned the High-Definition industry by announcing that they will back HD DVD exclusively. Paramount had previously released films in both formats while DreamWorks had yet to pick a winner in the battle.

The news led Blu-ray supporters to quickly charge that the studios had been paid off by Microsoft and Toshiba, the leading companies behind HD DVD.

The New York Times last week quoted an industry official as saying the studios received $150 million combined to back HD DVD, although the newspaper did not say who paid the studios.

But in a post at the Home Theater Forum message board, Collins said he was interrupting his vacation to "go on the record stating that Microsoft did not provide any financial incentives to Paramount/Dreamworks' recent decision to support HD DVD."

Referring to articles saying Microsoft had paid the studios, Collins continued: "This type of 'reporting' amazes me and I challenge anyone to provide proof around these statements. They are unfounded and inaccurate."

However, Collins appeared to indirectly confirm that Toshiba paid the studios. The Microsoft executive says an article by the web site Ain'tItCool.com accurately described why Paramount is supporting HD DVD.

The Ain'tItCool article notes that Paramount received an "advertising incentive" from Toshiba to make the switch, although it adds that the decision was based on other factors such as manufacturing costs and technological advantages.

Collins also seems to dismiss rumors that Microsoft is offering financial incentives to Warner Bros. to back HD DVD exclusively. The studio now releases titles in both formats.

"I hope this clears up the misinformation that has been reported regarding Microsoft’s involvement in the Paramount/Dreamworks decision or in the 'rumored' involvement with Warner," he writes in the post.

News Source: <a href="http://www.tvpredictions.com/microsoft082907.htm" target="_blank">tvpredictions.com</a>

[Aeond]

sure ms, we believe you :rolleyes:

[So-Unreal]

WTF does MS care about HD-DVD or Blue-Ray, They sell downloads not disc.

[jiminton]

MS really doesn't have anything to lose over this format war. Sony really only has the "PS3 plays HD movies" to lose. Sony was the largest producer of VHS players after it lost the format war versus VHS. MS could come out with a BD player add on to the 360. They would rather not have to pay the licensing fees but they could do it.
Sony wants blue ray to win so they can say PS3 plays HD.
Microsoft wants HD-DVD to win so Sony cannot say it.
Who gives a Fück.

[p$p b0y]

to be honest, excpt the fanboys on this forum trying to get more evidence that their purchase was the best, who will care?

how many of you own a ps2/xbox, pc and standalone dvd/cd player? i bet alot

my point being, if you wanna watch hd-dvd's/bluray movies and play games, your most likely gona end up with a ps3/360 and a standalone player anyways

[Ichinisan]

Only idiots ever thought it was Microsoft. Microsoft put themselves in a win-win position by providing DRM and video encoding technology to both platforms, so they aren't going to lose money for the sake of one format. Toshiba has been heavily subsidizing their player costs all along and they can't have much money now that they, with the HD-DVD group, have paid $150 million to Paramount. I'm sure that the emergeance of cheaper non-Toshiba players is freeing up the cash for this.

Oh, and this "selective" reporting is just plain annoying: HD-DVD Group (AKA "Toshiba") and the $150 million were known on the same day as the Dreamworks announcment, so this doesn't "leave" Toshiba as the only suspect (it was well known and reported all along). Microsoft is just trying to silence the retards who keep saying that Microsoft did it anyway due to retards' inability to read or distinguish (Microsoft does not equate with HD-DVD).

Microsoft's decision to make the HD-DVD drive was more of a way to subvert the PS3's "value" as a Blu-Ray player by dragging out the format war. They didn't stand to lose anything should HD-DVD fail (the drives are paid for by the consumer), but they'd lose precisely $150 million if they got into supporting the format needlessly by buying studio support. No matter what, how could anyone suspect Microsoft? How does Paramount make Microsoft money?

[Covert Knight]

No I believe MS didn't pay them. Someone else did, like Toshiba. See if HD-DVD loses the format war, for the most part MS doesn't really lose much at all. They only support it just to keep Sony from making profit, thats all. But remember it's not THEIR format. I think the HD-DVD manufacturers paid them off. So stop jumping to conclusions.

[cardboardbox]

the hd-dvd group sent the suitcase full of cash to paramount. The HD-DVD group gets its funding from its members. MS is their richest member. You do the math.

[sigma8]

MS really doesn't have anything to lose over this format war.
wrong.

They are just trying to silence the retards who keep saying that Microsoft did it anyway due to their own inability to read or distinguish (Microsoft does not equate with HD-DVD).
wrong.

Microsoft's decision to make the HD-DVD drive was more of a way to subvert the PS3's "value" as a Blu-Ray player by dragging out the format war.
wrong.

No I believe MS didn't pay them. Someone else did, like Toshiba. See if HD-DVD loses the format war, for the most part MS doesn't really lose much at all. They only support it just to keep Sony from making profit, thats all.
wrong.

First of all, I don't trust this Collins guy at all. He's the same guy who denies there even is a format war. If that $150 million came from a wholly owned subsidiary of Microsoft, then it technically didn't come from Microsoft. The money probably came from the HD-DVD group, and it probably "got there" due to a donation/contribution/transaction from Microsoft.

MS doesn't care about the video codecs. It cares about the fact that Java is being used....which means Windows Media player--and perhaps the Xbox360 itself--will need to start having Java installed on it....not something MS wants. They stopped including Java after a tussle with Sun year ago. There is no love lost there..

Also, they have serious issues with the DRM scheme. blu-ray throws a huge monkey wrench into MS's media platform plans... making it almost impossible without them coughing up huge sums of money in licensing and being at Sony's whim.

Some historical reading from a time when there was less "spin" and propaganda:

backgrounder:
http://www.engadget.com/2005/09/19/blu-ray-vs-hd-dvd-state-of-the-s-union-s-division/

Microsoft's motives--very interesting article...worth reading in full:
http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/oct2005/tc2005106_9074_tc024.htm

[XxBigP123xX]

moron of the year award goes to: XxBigP123xX
with:
Quote:
Originally Posted by XxBigP123xX View Post
wii isnt next gen though
source

you know thats true about the wii. and i didnt know next get was barely 3d mini games and games you finished 10 years ago.

oh and i hope you have fun doing exercise on your piece of plastic

[sigma8]

you know thats true about the wii. and i didnt know next get was barely 3d mini games and games you finished 10 years ago.

oh and i hope you have fun doing exercise on your piece of plastic

Are you posting in the wrong thread? wtf?

Do you know what "next-gen" is short for? It's "next generation". Nowhere in that phrase do I see the words "higher resolution graphics". All it really means is that the game belongs to a subsequent generation. If you look at what "generations" are, the barebones meaning is that each console is a generation.

So even though DS games are about as low-tech as N64 games, they are "next gen", because the hardware they are running on is the next in line of its generation.

[Ichinisan]

the hd-dvd group sent the suitcase full of cash to paramount. The HD-DVD group gets its funding from its members. MS is their richest member. You do the math.

Toshiba is their most invested member and the one steering it financially. They have FAR more to lose.

[p$p b0y]

@ sigma:
he was talking about my sig

and for the record, i dont own a wii, i own a 360, but i plan to get a wii.

i suppose next itll be, "i hope you have fun watching your rrod" or something stupid like that. funny thing is, the wii is actually fun, more fun than both the 360 and ps3, regardless of the technology in it.

(why has i sold over double the ps3 in the same time space, and nearly beaten/already beaten the 360 and has been our for a year less? because of the above statement, ITS FUN)

[put4558350]

If Paramount know about $150 standalone hd-dvd player will exist soon. I think it's good time to change side.

standalone player have more movie/unit than console. and hd-dvd sale standalone more than bru-ray.

The bru-ray is now in fact. depend on ps3 "The lose console even after price cut"

I hope MS to come up with build-in hd dvd drive on next xbox360 sku. to finish this format war.

[unwanted]

why has nobody thought of producing movies on a HD-DVD/BlueRay flip disc (each format on reverse side of the same disk, bit like the DVDs with widescreen and regular on the same disk used to be) or did they, but just thought it was a bad idea?

when is the LG player comming out that supports both formats?

btw: what technical advantages does HD-DVD have over Blue-Ray or vise-versa?

[Kenban]

why has nobody thought of producing movies on a HD-DVD/BlueRay flip disc (each format on reverse side of the same disk, bit like the DVDs with widescreen and regular on the same disk used to be) or did they, but just thought it was a bad idea?

when is the LG player comming out that supports both formats?

btw: what technical advantages does HD-DVD have over Blue-Ray or vise-versa?

Warner did think of it and announced them at CES and was hoping to have the first ones out by Christmas. No idea how far they are from production but as long as the studio remains neutral I expect to see them in the next few months.

EDIT: advantages and disadvantages (might be more this is off the top of my head)
HD-DVD cheaper to produce disks, cheaper players, ability to upgrade old DVD production equipment instead of needing new hardware, HD-DVD is a finished standard that all players since launch support. HD-DVD is an upgrade of the DVD standard and can support up to 3 layers 1 DVD 2 HD or 2 DVD and 1 HD layer. Instead of the current combo disks which you have to flip they can put all 3 on a single side which a DVD player only detects the DVD layer(s) while an HD-DVD player will detect both DVD and HD-DVD and should ask which to play. The disks are also cheaper to author. Disadvantages of HD-DVD include its lower transfer rate which can limit the video or audio bit rate in some situations it could also be limited by the lower disk space.

Blu-ray on the other hand have more disk space and a higher transfer rate. Interactivity is done through Java which is more powerful then the HDi used on HD-DVD. In addition to the AACS which is supported by both formats Blu-ray has BD+ which provides another layer of security. The big disadvantage of Blu-ray is cost but with that additional cost comes more power. So far not a single (including the PS3) Blu-ray player supports the newest version of the Blu-ray standard 1.1 it is expected the PS3 can be upgraded through firmware but it has not been confirmed or announced by Sony yet. But then no disks using the new standard have been released either.

[sigma8]

when is the LG player comming out that supports both formats?

btw: what technical advantages does HD-DVD have over Blue-Ray or vise-versa?

HD-DVD pros: currently cheaper production costs, easier development, interactivity specification is more complete

Blu-ray pros: larger disc capacity, extra scratch resistance, more powerful development tools

I look at these lists of advantages... and they are legitimate for the time being, and pretty much what people tout when they talk about one or the other. However, I think the following is inevitable:

- production costs for blu-ray will drop as economy of scale increases
- robust development toolsets will be created allowing easy development even on blu-ray
- blu-ray's "grace period" for supporting a draft subset of the full, planned interactivity specification will end, and it will then match or exceed HD-DVD's specs in that regard

Thus, I see many of HD-DVD's advantages as being short-term. In the end, they'll wind up being about equal...but blu-ray will have about twice the storage capacity and a more robust development environment.

HD-DVD is a fine disc, I just don't see the point. If someone offered me a 200 gig hard drive for $150 or a 120gig hard drive for $100, I would take the bigger hard drive.

If you asked me "What hard drive would you rather see adopted? A 200gig hard drive that is $150 now, and will be $100 in 3 years? Or a 150gig hard drive that is $100 now and will be $80 in 3 years?" I would easily pick the bigger one.. because it will be a much better dollar-per-gigabyte ratio. HD-DVD's chief advantage is that it's very similar to, structurally, to DVD...but that also means reducing its cost further will be more difficult.

Most of blu-ray's additional cost is tied up in a one-time cost of upgrading the factories that stamp the discs.

A $150 standalone player is very compelling, though. Since $400 HD-DVD players only handle 720p, I'm sure a $150 player will have a similiar limitation. I wonder if it might even only handle 480p. It might be more of a foot-in-the-door than a real product--just something for name's sake, so that they can say: "It's $150 and it plays HD-DVD's! (sure they don't look any better than normal DVD's when you play them on this)". We'll have to wait and see.

edit: I endorse Kenban's pros and cons list as well. It's a good list.

[MadMax31]

Of course not, they are busy fixing (and paying) the 360 manufacturing problems, they don't care about the format war, because if blue-ray wins, they'll make a player (even if they say they won't), they have nothing to lose in the format war unlike sony with it's blue-ray player that plays games :rolleyes:.

[unwanted]

thanks Kenban and Sigma 8 for the explaination in the differences in HD-DVD and Blue-Ray... I already knew about the larger capacity of Blue-Ray, and would have thought it was a greater advantage on its own...

I would have to say for me Blue-Ray (no matter that Sony use it, personally I hate Sony even though I own a PS3, (for blocking me importing to UK) even though they appear to eased off the blockade a bit) is personally the way to go, as what is the point in Upgrading my movies to end up with something that is a bit better than DVD when I can have something that will be alot better in the future (Blue-Ray)

I personally still think M$ still had something in helping the move for Paramount... IMO: M$ need to help prolong the DVD and HD-DVD formats as long as possible, I think they will have to add an internal Higher Capacity CD format eventually even if they dont like the idea (next year me thinks)...

[msanchez]

Even though production cost of BD are greater, I haven't seen a BD movie being more expensive then the HD-DVD version in a while, so to the consumer this isn't much of an issue currently. I could be wrong about the prices since I don't really look much at them due to a total lack of interest into buying movies for either format.

I think both formats are basically the same, they use the same video codecs, BD has better audio options, but lower minimum requirements for the studios to meet, price for the each type of media is too similar to bother comparing. The main advantages BD has to me is size of course (and I'm more of a fan of the pc usage of BD), and the fact that it's a growing format (all BD movies will be compatible with all BD players, but network or interactive options might not be available) which by the time that it finishes growing, or at least hits profile 2.0, will be better then HD-DVD in every way. Now HD-DVD has the advantage on the pricing of hardware, but that can change, or rather will, change if BD does win.

Oh and while they might not have directly payed, I think they did. You guys seem to forget that if BD wins the format war it will automatically make the ps3 a better purchase, which probably will take away customers from 360. I might be wrong but I don't see how they don't care who wins.

[thebox]

the hd-dvd group sent the suitcase full of cash to paramount. The HD-DVD group gets its funding from its members. MS is their richest member. You do the math.

The only one saying that Paramount got paid is Sony! What can they say? It doesn't look good that Paramount left, so make up a rumor that they got paid because Bluray is better! That's just what Sony always does!

[Kenban]

Blu-ray pros: larger disc capacity, extra scratch resistance, more powerful development tools

A $150 standalone player is very compelling, though. Since $400 HD-DVD players only handle 720p, I'm sure a $150 player will have a similiar limitation. I wonder if it might even only handle 480p. It might be more of a foot-in-the-door than a real product--just something for name's sake, so that they can say: "It's $150 and it plays HD-DVD's! (sure they don't look any better than normal DVD's when you play them on this)". We'll have to wait and see.

I never list the scratch resistance as a feature because while it is true if you do happen to scratch it the players and media are not as fault tolerant. For anyone who owns a PS3 or Blu-ray player never put a Blu-ray disk in a disk doctor you will destroy the disk.

The specs for the player have already been released and the price is actually a guess based on prices for Toshiba players. Its capable of 720p and 1080i just like the low end Toshiba. Since most consumers who do have HDTV's already have a 720p or 1080i set plus many (I suspect most) of the models on the market are still 720p I don't consider the player being limited to 720p or 1080i being that big of a deal currently.

[Mikeyy]

The only one saying that Paramount got paid is Sony! What can they say? It doesn't look good that Paramount left, so make up a rumor that they got paid because Bluray is better! That's just what Sony always does!

Excuse me? The NYTIMES broke the story, and even followed up to confirm it.

Worst case scenario is Microsoft gave $150mill to Toshiba, and Toshiba gave it to Paramount.

Even the details are out about it being an 18 month "promotion". Paramount didnt limit its sales out of the "Goodness of their hearts"

Everybody who thinks M$ didnt pay them off is in denial. M$ does win either way but its DEEPER. This paramount thing prolongs the war. During this time M$ will heavily promote its Video on Demand Downloading service. He plans to skip the entire HD medium and Goto the Internet.

Too bad ISPs are raining on the parade with "Packet Shaping", and Invisible Bandwidth limits..

[sigma8]

I never list the scratch resistance as a feature because while it is true if you do happen to scratch it the players and media are not as fault tolerant. For anyone who owns a PS3 or Blu-ray player never put a Blu-ray disk in a disk doctor you will destroy the disk.I wouldn't have listed it, if I posted yesterday. The only reason they put on the scratch resistant layer, is because the actual normal layer is so much thinner. However, I think it was that engadget article that said the TDK scratch resistant polymer is actually pretty good...not only scratch resistant, but smudge resistant (bonus). And tough. Probably worth more than .4 more millimeters of the normal plastic.

Scratch resistance isn't sliced bread, but let's be honest, from a consumer's point of view, there really aren't a lot of differences between these two formats. From an end-user perspective, the scratch resistance is a bigger day-to-day distinguishing feature than the BD-Java versus iHD implementations.

The specs for the player have already been released and the price is actually a guess based on prices for Toshiba players. Its capable of 720p and 1080i just like the low end Toshiba. Since most consumers who do have HDTV's already have a 720p or 1080i set plus many (I suspect most) of the models on the market are still 720p I don't consider the player being limited to 720p or 1080i being that big of a deal currently.

Wait...so the specs are set, but the price is up in the air? Isn't the current low-end Toshibia priced at $300? If the feature-set is the same as "current low end Toshibas" then what exactly merits the halving of the price? Presumably the new model is MORE entry level, otherwise wouldn't they just lower the price of the HD-A2 (or the current cheapest one)?

[cardboardbox]

The only one saying that Paramount got paid is Sony! What can they say? It doesn't look good that Paramount left, so make up a rumor that they got paid because Bluray is better! That's just what Sony always does!yeah, who reads the NY Times anyway.

[DEDDOA]

LOL WTF :eek::eek::D:D:D:D:D

What sad PS3 fanboy claimed MS paid off Paramount :D:D:D:D

I've heard some stupid fanboy claims in my time but this one has to be one of the best. What do MS care if Paramount or any other studion does not exclusively support HD-DVD, they don't even push their own player. Sad the things some people will come up with :D:D:D:D

[Xenogears V]

I don't understand as there is people that still thinks about the Hd-Dvd.

The difference among Hd-Dvd and Blu-Ray, is the same that there is among Cd-Rom and Dvd.

You read on Wikipedia.

[lee6370]

I don't understand as there is people that still thinks about the Hd-Dvd.

The difference among Hd-Dvd and Blu-Ray, is the same that there is among Cd-Rom and Dvd.

You read on Wikipedia.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry at your stupiditity.

Just because you keept saying something won't make it true.

[Kenban]

Wait...so the specs are set, but the price is up in the air? Isn't the current low-end Toshibia priced at $300? If the feature-set is the same as "current low end Toshibas" then what exactly merits the halving of the price? Presumably the new model is MORE entry level, otherwise wouldn't they just lower the price of the HD-A2 (or the current cheapest one)?

When people say $150 they mean thats what it will sell for not the MSRP. For example the HD-A2 has an MSRP of $299 but Amazon.com's regular price is $238 and can be had for $210 with 8 free movies. To compete it has to be cheaper. Since the player is not from Toshiba why would it effect the price or need to have less features then the HD-A2?

[jerzmob]

LIES LIES LIES YEAAAHHH!!!!:p

[cardboardbox]

LOL WTF :eek::eek::D:D:D:D:D

What sad PS3 fanboy claimed MS paid off Paramount :D:D:D:D

I've heard some stupid fanboy claims in my time but this one has to be one of the best. What do MS care if Paramount or any other studion does not exclusively support HD-DVD, they don't even push their own player. Sad the things some people will come up with :D:D:D:D
oh my, where do you think hd-dvd gets their funding and bribe money from?